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[Music]

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it was basically a cube with inside of

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sphere where the points of the cube

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were touching outside of sphere

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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so this isn't anything that just is

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limited to the united states it's a

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that ufo podcast is powered by zencastr

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seamlessly record their guests remotely

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and produce their podcasts and studio

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quality check out the links in the show

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description to find out more

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join over 2 million men worldwide who

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and the ufo at manscape.com

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i'm one of the first people to try the

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new 4.0 and i am blown away by the

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performance the craftsmanship and

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details on the 4.0 are next level

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generations ahead of where it should be

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their advanced ceramic blade and skin

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safe technology is so good that it

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almost seems as a landscape to work with

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at s4 with fablazar and others to ensure

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your sources are as safe as possible

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this is david marlar ufo researcher and

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hi everyone and welcome back to that ufo

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podcast as always my name is andy and

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i've been looking forward to this one

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i've said many times on the podcast i

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love discussing ufos uep aliens and all

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that entails but i've got a proper thing

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for remote viewing it's one of my secret

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passions to talk about a bit of a guilty

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pleasure as well so i'm very excited to

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welcome remote viewer clairvoyant and

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author among many things deborah katz to

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the podcast deborah how are you yes

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thank you andrew i'm happy to be here

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with you yeah listen um loads of

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interest in this one whenever we do have

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and they're few and far between i should

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really do more but remote viewing

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episodes um a lot of interest a lot of

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questions off the back of these as well

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and i think it's a good time to speak to

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you because there's a lot going on in

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the world of remote viewing you've got a

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book coming out there is the irva

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conference coming up as well and i've

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just heard you on coast to coast which

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gave me a whole load more questions to

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ask you on top of of everything else so

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deborah if you're good let's get right

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into it um deborah i want to discuss

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with you a little bit first your

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background and

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for me at what age do you realize you

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have some sort of extra sensory ability

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or you're you're in chin with something

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else that just isn't the same as

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everyone else

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well

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that's a two-part question in a way

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because i i had experiences

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very very young as as young as i can

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remember

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but i never looked at it as different

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than anybody else i

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just thought that's how everyone

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experienced their life and i have an

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identical twin sister named amy and she

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and i would

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all the time be communicating just

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what i later learned was telepathically

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but where we would have conversations

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with each other in our minds and the

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other one would just know what the other

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one was thinking and when we would talk

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to other people it would you know any

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couple that's been together whether as

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siblings or husband and wife they're

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gonna get to know each other so well

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that they're gonna finish each other's

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sentences or know what to expect so

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there's a little bit of okay well was

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this going on because we just were

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together every moment even before we

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were born or or was it because we were

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you know having mind-to-mind

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communication but it really did seem

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like we were so plugged in on that level

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and then we would have experiences where

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we were even communicating with each

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other in our dreams and having shared

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dreams and then we were also seeing

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operations in our house and we there was

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one that used to stand in my parents in

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the doorway of my parents bedroom it was

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a figure of a man and he was filled in

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with like this it looked like snow on

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one of the older tv sets just like black

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and white

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uh dots that filled him up and every

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morning this was when i was about four

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or five years old if i wanted to run

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into my parents bedroom i had to

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get up on my nerve

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before i was ready to just like run past

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it and i would run past it and then it

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would disappear and i didn't tell anyone

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about this for almost a year and then

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one day i was talking to my sister and

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she told me she was seeing the exact

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same thing

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but she hadn't told anyone so it was

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from experiences like that that we knew

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that there was so much more than just

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the physical but we thought this was

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totally

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normal and then we found out as we got

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older that no not everyone believed in

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all of this and that was a big shock

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but i still contend now after having

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gone through so many more

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experiences and going through training

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of many different types of modalities

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and now i'm i've for the past 2 almost

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25 years i've been training other people

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in many different kinds of intuitive

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processes and i am absolutely positive

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that this is just part of our normal

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perception it's just a matter of some

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people have it more than others or

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different types initially but these

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things can be brought out in people it

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just takes focusing and understanding

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how to bring it out

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and actually interesting you mentioned

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you've got a twin sister and you always

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hear people talk about the twin thing or

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you know i i've got uncles that both

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broke bones at the exact same time um

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on the same day when they were kids you

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know and it's crazy timing coincidence

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whatever you might want to call it but

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there's something to that and like you

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say maybe not everyone realizes or has

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it to the same level that there's

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something potentially telepathic going

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on but it's just there in some way shape

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or form does your sister still through

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adulthood have the same interest or or

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same intuition that she had back then

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yes definitely so she is a professional

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psychic and intuitive

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and

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as well as myself but we've gone on

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different paths in terms of our

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approaches to our work so there's

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definitely crossover but she has

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different she works with people in a

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different way and uses different

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techniques has some different interests

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so we could talk about that too like the

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differences because a lot of people

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don't realize how involved it is and you

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know getting down to

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techniques like are you using visual are

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you using somatic uh

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experiences or letting your body express

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itself are you auditorily or through

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mediumship getting impressions so you

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know some people are using all of these

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and then some people are using more than

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others

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well let's talk about that and strip it

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back then so in your words debra because

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you're an expert

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what is remote viewing how do you put

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that across to someone in simple terms

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yes

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so because people do ask that they say

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well i'm hearing a lot about remote

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viewing these days but how is that

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different from just

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using your psychic abilities just in

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other ways and so the term remote

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viewing

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people will sometimes use it

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synonymously with clairvoyance being

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able to see information at a distance

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but those who call themselves remote

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viewers primarily remote viewers are

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usually talking about using approaches

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that came out of a particular historical

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context and that context would be the

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remote viewing programs that were part

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of the us government program spanning

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back from the 1970s

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and so with those with that approach

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remote viewing is really considered more

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of a setup or a

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a particular

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methodology well i shouldn't say

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particular i should say a setup where

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you're you're tuning into things at a

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distance where you don't have

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information about them to begin with and

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so there's certain

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it really mirrors scientific protocols

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because you're starting off with as

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little information as possible you're

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going through a systematic approach

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you're using your psychic abilities

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within that approach and then and then

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you're

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having it carefully analyzed and

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recorded so it's really kind of more

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just

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the way that you're using your psychic

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abilities in more of a formal setup

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and it could be very informal formal but

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still a setup or

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or

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structured and done in a particular

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way

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yes

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so ingo swann

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was the person who coined the term

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remote viewing and yes his definition

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when people would ask him what it was he

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said it's more of like an experimental

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setup than it is just an ability

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so but there's so so much crossover so

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for example if i just wanted to simply

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use my clairvoyance let's say to

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find a missing wallet or some missing

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money i might if it was my own wallet

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and it was something or let's say my

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husband's that has happened many times

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he was looking for something and i

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needed to help him and he's like i can't

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find it so i could just sit down close

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my eyes and wait for an impression to

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come

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and if if the money or whatever is

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missing happens to be at a landmark that

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i can easily

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recognize

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then i could just like jump up after 30

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seconds and go in and try to find that

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landmark so

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that would be like simple clairvoyance

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but if i really let's say a client wants

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me to find something like i have a

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client right now whose great great

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grandfather supposedly buried money on

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an indian reservation

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in the 1950s and she's positive it's

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there so i have to find it so how am i

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going to approach that i'm going to do

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it through formal remote viewing so this

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is going to involve sitting down with

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paper and pen and i do have to say even

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knowing that is more than a lot of times

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remote viewers know sometimes they don't

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even know they're looking for money

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they're just given a target number and

280
00:11:34,150 --> 00:11:32,560
said told to describe this but i i do

281
00:11:36,389 --> 00:11:34,160
know that but i'm also going to give the

282
00:11:38,389 --> 00:11:36,399
task to my students and not even tell

283
00:11:40,790 --> 00:11:38,399
them that it's money i'm just going to

284
00:11:43,269 --> 00:11:40,800
say do a remote viewing session so we're

285
00:11:45,990 --> 00:11:43,279
going to sit down with a piece of paper

286
00:11:48,150 --> 00:11:46,000
and probably go for a couple hours and

287
00:11:50,790 --> 00:11:48,160
we're going to move our consciousnesses

288
00:11:52,710 --> 00:11:50,800
all over the location and like i'll

289
00:11:53,829 --> 00:11:52,720
probably tell myself i'm going to bring

290
00:11:56,629 --> 00:11:53,839
myself

291
00:11:58,870 --> 00:11:56,639
in relation to the money i'm gonna touch

292
00:12:00,470 --> 00:11:58,880
the money in my imagination and then i'm

293
00:12:03,269 --> 00:12:00,480
gonna look around and then i'm gonna

294
00:12:06,230 --> 00:12:03,279
start recording and sketching everything

295
00:12:08,870 --> 00:12:06,240
i get and then i can go up above like

296
00:12:11,350 --> 00:12:08,880
500 feet and look down and survey the

297
00:12:13,590 --> 00:12:11,360
area get a description of the area and

298
00:12:16,629 --> 00:12:13,600
then i'm gonna write that down and do

299
00:12:19,990 --> 00:12:16,639
sketches and then after a few hours i'll

300
00:12:22,629 --> 00:12:20,000
create a just like a whole map and then

301
00:12:25,350 --> 00:12:22,639
give that to the the client along with a

302
00:12:27,750 --> 00:12:25,360
polished summary so you can see this

303
00:12:31,350 --> 00:12:27,760
would be a lot more involved than just

304
00:12:32,790 --> 00:12:31,360
i'm tuning in for just a couple moments

305
00:12:34,870 --> 00:12:32,800
and can i just ask this might be a

306
00:12:36,230 --> 00:12:34,880
really silly question but when you say

307
00:12:38,949 --> 00:12:36,240
you're going to go up above do you mean

308
00:12:41,829 --> 00:12:38,959
physically or is that like an outer body

309
00:12:45,030 --> 00:12:41,839
type you know surveying of the area

310
00:12:47,670 --> 00:12:45,040
yeah excellent question well i'm gonna

311
00:12:50,310 --> 00:12:47,680
imagine of of course it's happening in

312
00:12:51,990 --> 00:12:50,320
my imagination so i'm i'm not there i'm

313
00:12:53,430 --> 00:12:52,000
just in my living room for this whole

314
00:12:56,550 --> 00:12:53,440
process because i don't even know where

315
00:12:57,430 --> 00:12:56,560
there is i i know that it's somewhere

316
00:12:59,670 --> 00:12:57,440
out

317
00:13:01,670 --> 00:12:59,680
in the wilderness

318
00:13:03,670 --> 00:13:01,680
but that's the only thing i know and

319
00:13:07,350 --> 00:13:03,680
that and i don't even know what country

320
00:13:09,269 --> 00:13:07,360
my client's in so but what i do know is

321
00:13:12,949 --> 00:13:09,279
if the money is there it exists

322
00:13:15,910 --> 00:13:12,959
somewhere so in my imagination i'm gonna

323
00:13:18,310 --> 00:13:15,920
i'm gonna imagine i'm going right to the

324
00:13:20,389 --> 00:13:18,320
money and putting my hand on it and

325
00:13:23,430 --> 00:13:20,399
something starts to happen when you do

326
00:13:26,710 --> 00:13:23,440
that now it's not like i can

327
00:13:29,110 --> 00:13:26,720
just at will have a full blown

328
00:13:30,150 --> 00:13:29,120
out-of-body experience like

329
00:13:31,509 --> 00:13:30,160
some

330
00:13:33,509 --> 00:13:31,519
and we could talk about that if you've

331
00:13:35,829 --> 00:13:33,519
ever had one i've i've only had like

332
00:13:38,310 --> 00:13:35,839
maybe five times where i really

333
00:13:41,829 --> 00:13:38,320
experienced a total separation from my

334
00:13:44,069 --> 00:13:41,839
body but in in this case what happens is

335
00:13:46,710 --> 00:13:44,079
when you imagine yourself somewhere else

336
00:13:48,949 --> 00:13:46,720
at a distance it's almost like it slowly

337
00:13:51,350 --> 00:13:48,959
starts to happen so it's not a

338
00:13:53,990 --> 00:13:51,360
full-blown one but

339
00:13:56,629 --> 00:13:54,000
it's where you start to have um

340
00:14:00,069 --> 00:13:56,639
you you'll have moments of like oh i

341
00:14:02,550 --> 00:14:00,079
just suddenly felt wind rushed past me

342
00:14:05,189 --> 00:14:02,560
or i just suddenly felt heat

343
00:14:07,590 --> 00:14:05,199
or i could see there's like shadows and

344
00:14:09,990 --> 00:14:07,600
big trees up above me so it's like you

345
00:14:13,110 --> 00:14:10,000
start to have impressions and some of

346
00:14:15,269 --> 00:14:13,120
them it's not just visual impressions

347
00:14:18,629 --> 00:14:15,279
but it is like where your body is

348
00:14:21,350 --> 00:14:18,639
actually having sensations of the place

349
00:14:23,350 --> 00:14:21,360
and so while we can't prove that this is

350
00:14:26,310 --> 00:14:23,360
actually happening i do feel like the

351
00:14:28,470 --> 00:14:26,320
longer that you are imagining you're at

352
00:14:30,230 --> 00:14:28,480
a distant location and you're doing

353
00:14:32,550 --> 00:14:30,240
these what's called movement commands

354
00:14:35,430 --> 00:14:32,560
going from different perspectives the

355
00:14:38,470 --> 00:14:35,440
longer you stay there and interact you i

356
00:14:39,350 --> 00:14:38,480
do feel like a part of our energy field

357
00:14:44,949 --> 00:14:39,360
is

358
00:14:45,910 --> 00:14:44,959
becoming integrated with the location

359
00:14:51,350 --> 00:14:45,920
and

360
00:14:53,829 --> 00:14:51,360
like astral traveling or an out-of-body

361
00:14:57,189 --> 00:14:53,839
experience it's just not a full-blown

362
00:15:00,230 --> 00:14:57,199
one so i'm still at many times very very

363
00:15:03,269 --> 00:15:00,240
aware that i'm sitting in my living room

364
00:15:06,230 --> 00:15:03,279
or office working with the paper and i

365
00:15:07,990 --> 00:15:06,240
would say that tends to be overall if

366
00:15:09,110 --> 00:15:08,000
you talk to remote viewers they would

367
00:15:12,470 --> 00:15:09,120
probably

368
00:15:14,949 --> 00:15:12,480
agree mostly of what i'm describing now

369
00:15:16,949 --> 00:15:14,959
some don't feel like they're integrating

370
00:15:18,550 --> 00:15:16,959
so much with the target some are just

371
00:15:20,470 --> 00:15:18,560
like oh well i don't think i'm going

372
00:15:22,550 --> 00:15:20,480
anywhere i'm just you know i'm just

373
00:15:24,310 --> 00:15:22,560
writing and things are appearing on the

374
00:15:26,870 --> 00:15:24,320
paper and

375
00:15:31,110 --> 00:15:26,880
so not everyone has such

376
00:15:33,269 --> 00:15:31,120
such a um disconnected experience but a

377
00:15:36,069 --> 00:15:33,279
lot of them do

378
00:15:37,910 --> 00:15:36,079
and you know it doesn't necessarily it's

379
00:15:40,790 --> 00:15:37,920
a helpful approach to imagine that

380
00:15:42,470 --> 00:15:40,800
you're going out and that's the thing as

381
00:15:45,670 --> 00:15:42,480
i'm talking like i'm sure some of your

382
00:15:48,550 --> 00:15:45,680
listeners are thinking well you know i i

383
00:15:50,550 --> 00:15:48,560
do this a lot just spontaneously because

384
00:15:53,189 --> 00:15:50,560
you could think of another person like

385
00:15:55,350 --> 00:15:53,199
let's say you meet like a potential

386
00:15:57,189 --> 00:15:55,360
romantic partner so you start thinking

387
00:15:59,350 --> 00:15:57,199
about them and wondering about what it

388
00:16:01,110 --> 00:15:59,360
would be like to be with them and as

389
00:16:03,030 --> 00:16:01,120
you're just wondering that it may not be

390
00:16:06,550 --> 00:16:03,040
like you're thinking oh i'm gonna you

391
00:16:09,269 --> 00:16:06,560
know go send myself over there but just

392
00:16:11,509 --> 00:16:09,279
where our thoughts go our energy goes

393
00:16:13,990 --> 00:16:11,519
and our consciousness goes so if you're

394
00:16:15,910 --> 00:16:14,000
really thinking about someone intently

395
00:16:18,470 --> 00:16:15,920
you could just accidentally start to

396
00:16:20,230 --> 00:16:18,480
pick up things like you might suddenly

397
00:16:23,269 --> 00:16:20,240
start to

398
00:16:26,389 --> 00:16:23,279
smell smell them or what's around them

399
00:16:28,870 --> 00:16:26,399
or you know experience how their body is

400
00:16:30,790 --> 00:16:28,880
feeling just not you you may not even

401
00:16:33,670 --> 00:16:30,800
believe in psychic stuff but just be

402
00:16:37,189 --> 00:16:33,680
thinking of someone so intently and and

403
00:16:39,829 --> 00:16:37,199
this is this will happen for some people

404
00:16:41,509 --> 00:16:39,839
more strongly than others and it's also

405
00:16:43,910 --> 00:16:41,519
depends who you're thinking about but

406
00:16:46,230 --> 00:16:43,920
you could easily then start to pick up

407
00:16:48,550 --> 00:16:46,240
aspects of what's going on with them and

408
00:16:50,470 --> 00:16:48,560
the thing is if for people who aren't

409
00:16:52,629 --> 00:16:50,480
aware that can happen

410
00:16:54,870 --> 00:16:52,639
they may just suddenly like feel an

411
00:16:56,710 --> 00:16:54,880
emotion and not realize like oh this

412
00:16:59,430 --> 00:16:56,720
isn't even my emotion this is their

413
00:17:01,430 --> 00:16:59,440
emotion you know or they might suddenly

414
00:17:03,990 --> 00:17:01,440
like i was feeling so

415
00:17:07,270 --> 00:17:04,000
i yesterday i was really energetic and

416
00:17:11,029 --> 00:17:07,280
then suddenly i just felt so exhausted i

417
00:17:12,870 --> 00:17:11,039
had to go lay down and i found out a

418
00:17:14,549 --> 00:17:12,880
short time later that a friend of mine

419
00:17:16,230 --> 00:17:14,559
who wasn't feeling well was trying to

420
00:17:19,590 --> 00:17:16,240
get in touch with me to see if i would

421
00:17:22,870 --> 00:17:19,600
do an energy healing on her and as soon

422
00:17:24,870 --> 00:17:22,880
as i realized that i felt fine but so

423
00:17:27,029 --> 00:17:24,880
this can happen both when we're thinking

424
00:17:28,789 --> 00:17:27,039
about other people or when other people

425
00:17:30,630 --> 00:17:28,799
start to think about us especially if

426
00:17:33,510 --> 00:17:30,640
they really feel like oh you know i

427
00:17:36,950 --> 00:17:33,520
gotta get in touch and but sometimes

428
00:17:38,789 --> 00:17:36,960
we're not aware of the difference

429
00:17:40,950 --> 00:17:38,799
really interesting use a language that

430
00:17:43,590 --> 00:17:40,960
you've used the word imagination quite a

431
00:17:45,830 --> 00:17:43,600
lot but as if imagination is a tool that

432
00:17:48,230 --> 00:17:45,840
can be harnessed and used and in quite a

433
00:17:49,669 --> 00:17:48,240
positive sense because i think when

434
00:17:53,029 --> 00:17:49,679
especially when you have conversations

435
00:17:55,270 --> 00:17:53,039
about remote viewing ufos uaps all of

436
00:17:58,390 --> 00:17:55,280
this sort of subject anything you want

437
00:18:00,470 --> 00:17:58,400
to classify maybe as paranormal people

438
00:18:01,990 --> 00:18:00,480
levy the the accusation

439
00:18:03,270 --> 00:18:02,000
it's all just your imagination but

440
00:18:05,350 --> 00:18:03,280
you're using it in quite a positive

441
00:18:07,190 --> 00:18:05,360
sense is that the way you see

442
00:18:08,070 --> 00:18:07,200
imagination

443
00:18:10,390 --> 00:18:08,080
yes

444
00:18:13,110 --> 00:18:10,400
i'm so glad that you brought that up in

445
00:18:16,310 --> 00:18:13,120
fact i i have done a

446
00:18:17,750 --> 00:18:16,320
a video on this topic i think it's on my

447
00:18:20,950 --> 00:18:17,760
youtube page

448
00:18:23,750 --> 00:18:20,960
so i i think we almost need different

449
00:18:25,190 --> 00:18:23,760
language or words for these things

450
00:18:30,070 --> 00:18:25,200
because

451
00:18:32,950 --> 00:18:30,080
yes our imagination is absolutely a tool

452
00:18:35,510 --> 00:18:32,960
or a toolbox i should say because within

453
00:18:39,990 --> 00:18:35,520
that toolbox then there's other tools

454
00:18:40,710 --> 00:18:40,000
as well but this is the way that our

455
00:18:46,150 --> 00:18:40,720
so

456
00:18:49,270 --> 00:18:46,160
abilities especially our visual ability

457
00:18:51,830 --> 00:18:49,280
can come through it's it has to work

458
00:18:55,270 --> 00:18:51,840
it's like the fabric or the material of

459
00:18:58,870 --> 00:18:55,280
our consciousness and so the information

460
00:19:00,310 --> 00:18:58,880
will flow through it to express itself

461
00:19:03,270 --> 00:19:00,320
now

462
00:19:06,070 --> 00:19:03,280
that's not to say that we can't also use

463
00:19:08,950 --> 00:19:06,080
our imagination to come up with things

464
00:19:12,070 --> 00:19:08,960
that aren't true or just part of our

465
00:19:15,110 --> 00:19:12,080
logic or are just kind of creative but

466
00:19:17,909 --> 00:19:15,120
not connected to the actual target or

467
00:19:18,630 --> 00:19:17,919
what we're going for so

468
00:19:25,350 --> 00:19:18,640
so

469
00:19:27,750 --> 00:19:25,360
and part of it is being able to discern

470
00:19:29,029 --> 00:19:27,760
between what is just

471
00:19:36,710 --> 00:19:29,039
your own

472
00:19:38,390 --> 00:19:36,720
the actual

473
00:19:41,430 --> 00:19:38,400
intuitive information

474
00:19:43,750 --> 00:19:41,440
coming in and and it still has to use

475
00:19:47,190 --> 00:19:43,760
your you know something within yourself

476
00:19:51,190 --> 00:19:47,200
that you can recognize or use so it is

477
00:19:53,750 --> 00:19:51,200
it is complex and that's part of the

478
00:19:57,110 --> 00:19:53,760
the training like i do with my students

479
00:19:59,750 --> 00:19:57,120
is to learn to how to discern between

480
00:20:02,630 --> 00:19:59,760
all of that but part of it is also

481
00:20:04,549 --> 00:20:02,640
really just a lot of practice and a lot

482
00:20:06,390 --> 00:20:04,559
of experience

483
00:20:08,149 --> 00:20:06,400
because you have to

484
00:20:10,390 --> 00:20:08,159
you have to really know

485
00:20:13,029 --> 00:20:10,400
i call it your baseline like know your

486
00:20:15,590 --> 00:20:13,039
own baseline of your thoughts and your

487
00:20:18,470 --> 00:20:15,600
feelings to be able to discern the

488
00:20:21,350 --> 00:20:18,480
information and a lot of times what ends

489
00:20:24,070 --> 00:20:21,360
up being wrong is the interpretations

490
00:20:25,669 --> 00:20:24,080
of the information as well so that's

491
00:20:28,549 --> 00:20:25,679
like and especially in remote viewing

492
00:20:31,430 --> 00:20:28,559
there's a term called analytic overlay

493
00:20:32,950 --> 00:20:31,440
and that has to do with where you know

494
00:20:35,669 --> 00:20:32,960
you

495
00:20:37,590 --> 00:20:35,679
um

496
00:20:40,230 --> 00:20:37,600
let's say someone's giving you an object

497
00:20:43,029 --> 00:20:40,240
to describe and you see something red

498
00:20:45,990 --> 00:20:43,039
and round and immediately your mind goes

499
00:20:48,230 --> 00:20:46,000
to a tomato and it's not a tomato it's a

500
00:20:51,669 --> 00:20:48,240
red ball or maybe it's a building that's

501
00:20:53,750 --> 00:20:51,679
round in red but your imagination just

502
00:20:56,470 --> 00:20:53,760
comes up this happens so fast that

503
00:20:58,789 --> 00:20:56,480
sometimes it's it's through logical

504
00:21:01,510 --> 00:20:58,799
deduction like oh i see red i see round

505
00:21:04,230 --> 00:21:01,520
must be a tomato or an apple but it can

506
00:21:06,870 --> 00:21:04,240
happen spontaneously where you just like

507
00:21:09,029 --> 00:21:06,880
get an image of the tomato and apple and

508
00:21:11,110 --> 00:21:09,039
then you didn't even like go through any

509
00:21:13,669 --> 00:21:11,120
thought processes it just appeared and

510
00:21:16,789 --> 00:21:13,679
then you find out no it wasn't that but

511
00:21:19,190 --> 00:21:16,799
it was this building that was red and

512
00:21:21,669 --> 00:21:19,200
round and who you know is used to seeing

513
00:21:23,669 --> 00:21:21,679
things like that so it's it's working

514
00:21:26,789 --> 00:21:23,679
with things like that where we're really

515
00:21:30,149 --> 00:21:26,799
up against our own perception of the way

516
00:21:31,909 --> 00:21:30,159
our perception works and and we're when

517
00:21:33,510 --> 00:21:31,919
we're remote viewing or using any

518
00:21:35,669 --> 00:21:33,520
psychic abilities it's almost like we're

519
00:21:38,789 --> 00:21:35,679
having to re-learn how to orientate

520
00:21:40,789 --> 00:21:38,799
ourselves to our own perceptions now i

521
00:21:43,029 --> 00:21:40,799
do also want to say speaking to your

522
00:21:45,270 --> 00:21:43,039
question that you know people do have to

523
00:21:47,990 --> 00:21:45,280
be discerning when they just have some

524
00:21:50,230 --> 00:21:48,000
kind of experience and you know there's

525
00:21:53,110 --> 00:21:50,240
so often there is just logical

526
00:21:55,669 --> 00:21:53,120
explanations for things and one example

527
00:21:57,750 --> 00:21:55,679
i like to give i i was in sedona with a

528
00:22:00,789 --> 00:21:57,760
friend and we were taking pictures and

529
00:22:04,390 --> 00:22:00,799
suddenly this thing started to appear in

530
00:22:07,029 --> 00:22:04,400
our pictures it was like this big

531
00:22:09,430 --> 00:22:07,039
glowing thing in the middle of as we

532
00:22:11,510 --> 00:22:09,440
were taking pictures of the vortexes and

533
00:22:13,909 --> 00:22:11,520
we got so excited we were just like

534
00:22:16,549 --> 00:22:13,919
screaming and screaming and taking as

535
00:22:18,310 --> 00:22:16,559
many pictures as we can and then i

536
00:22:19,350 --> 00:22:18,320
thought wait a second

537
00:22:21,750 --> 00:22:19,360
oh no

538
00:22:23,430 --> 00:22:21,760
and then i i thought could this possibly

539
00:22:24,710 --> 00:22:23,440
be my thumb

540
00:22:27,590 --> 00:22:24,720
and so

541
00:22:30,310 --> 00:22:27,600
i went and and tested it out took some

542
00:22:33,270 --> 00:22:30,320
pictures of my thumb and it was we had

543
00:22:36,470 --> 00:22:33,280
gotten all excited and all it was

544
00:22:38,549 --> 00:22:36,480
was a finger in the lens with the sun

545
00:22:40,710 --> 00:22:38,559
hitting it so you know you gotta when

546
00:22:41,669 --> 00:22:40,720
you're having these experiences you so

547
00:22:44,470 --> 00:22:41,679
much

548
00:22:46,470 --> 00:22:44,480
have to rule those out especially before

549
00:22:48,070 --> 00:22:46,480
you're gonna start announcing to other

550
00:22:50,870 --> 00:22:48,080
people that you've just you know had

551
00:22:52,230 --> 00:22:50,880
this discovery

552
00:22:53,590 --> 00:22:52,240
yeah and you know what that that's a

553
00:22:55,350 --> 00:22:53,600
good sign though that you can see

554
00:22:57,750 --> 00:22:55,360
yourself that you're not going to pass

555
00:22:59,750 --> 00:22:57,760
that off as being something it isn't and

556
00:23:01,990 --> 00:22:59,760
god knows as part of the ufo community

557
00:23:03,990 --> 00:23:02,000
we see pictures and i've got listeners

558
00:23:05,990 --> 00:23:04,000
every day sending me videos and pictures

559
00:23:07,909 --> 00:23:06,000
and andy look at this and what do you

560
00:23:10,630 --> 00:23:07,919
think this is and so much of it it's

561
00:23:11,510 --> 00:23:10,640
like it's interesting but given it's one

562
00:23:13,270 --> 00:23:11,520
source

563
00:23:15,110 --> 00:23:13,280
it's really hard to tell with nothing

564
00:23:17,990 --> 00:23:15,120
else in a longer video or you know a

565
00:23:19,590 --> 00:23:18,000
zoom or a close-up but then you get

566
00:23:22,310 --> 00:23:19,600
things that are clearly

567
00:23:24,149 --> 00:23:22,320
as a plane or it's a bird that's flying

568
00:23:26,310 --> 00:23:24,159
past but they want it to be something

569
00:23:27,669 --> 00:23:26,320
else so badly that they really don't

570
00:23:29,430 --> 00:23:27,679
like when when they're told and this

571
00:23:31,590 --> 00:23:29,440
goes for twitter or facebook or whatever

572
00:23:32,950 --> 00:23:31,600
else that that's not the thing that you

573
00:23:34,710 --> 00:23:32,960
you think it is

574
00:23:36,789 --> 00:23:34,720
and i'm guessing when it comes to remote

575
00:23:39,350 --> 00:23:36,799
viewing as well there's that

576
00:23:40,470 --> 00:23:39,360
interpretation of a target and i want to

577
00:23:42,230 --> 00:23:40,480
ask you because something that's

578
00:23:43,350 --> 00:23:42,240
interested me and you mentioned target

579
00:23:46,070 --> 00:23:43,360
numbers

580
00:23:47,430 --> 00:23:46,080
now you're not normally told

581
00:23:49,510 --> 00:23:47,440
you know i suppose people think of

582
00:23:51,830 --> 00:23:49,520
remote viewing in a kind of sexy

583
00:23:54,070 --> 00:23:51,840
hollywood way they think about remote

584
00:23:55,750 --> 00:23:54,080
viewing the you know codes to a nuclear

585
00:23:58,070 --> 00:23:55,760
launch uh

586
00:23:59,830 --> 00:23:58,080
somewhere or you know go find

587
00:24:01,990 --> 00:23:59,840
the russians have this briefcase what's

588
00:24:03,990 --> 00:24:02,000
inside the briefcase but normally when

589
00:24:06,230 --> 00:24:04,000
i'm seeing people at doing remote

590
00:24:07,669 --> 00:24:06,240
viewing online i've seen simeon hein who

591
00:24:09,990 --> 00:24:07,679
i've interviewed several times on the

592
00:24:12,549 --> 00:24:10,000
podcast and he'll put on his youtube

593
00:24:14,549 --> 00:24:12,559
channel a list of numbers and you have

594
00:24:16,470 --> 00:24:14,559
to remote view

595
00:24:17,750 --> 00:24:16,480
those numbers how does that work what

596
00:24:19,590 --> 00:24:17,760
are people looking at when they see

597
00:24:21,750 --> 00:24:19,600
these numbers because that seems to be

598
00:24:23,990 --> 00:24:21,760
for people looking to get into this in

599
00:24:24,789 --> 00:24:24,000
quite a basic way as well

600
00:24:28,149 --> 00:24:24,799
yeah

601
00:24:30,950 --> 00:24:28,159
so the numbers allowed to tune into a

602
00:24:33,669 --> 00:24:30,960
subject without knowing anything about

603
00:24:36,310 --> 00:24:33,679
it in advance so to be blind to it so

604
00:24:39,190 --> 00:24:36,320
for example with my example

605
00:24:41,110 --> 00:24:39,200
of my client who has this missing money

606
00:24:42,149 --> 00:24:41,120
from her grandfather

607
00:24:53,350 --> 00:24:42,159
i

608
00:24:57,190 --> 00:24:53,360
number

609
00:24:59,350 --> 00:24:57,200
with the task so to speak and i can do

610
00:25:01,830 --> 00:24:59,360
that by writing it on a piece of paper

611
00:25:04,549 --> 00:25:01,840
or in this case a document on my

612
00:25:08,070 --> 00:25:04,559
computer and so i label it

613
00:25:10,710 --> 00:25:08,080
i label what i want them to do like find

614
00:25:13,990 --> 00:25:10,720
find the money exactly where it is

615
00:25:16,870 --> 00:25:14,000
located now find find discernible

616
00:25:19,350 --> 00:25:16,880
landmarks to help people searching for

617
00:25:21,029 --> 00:25:19,360
it to find it right now in present time

618
00:25:24,149 --> 00:25:21,039
because things might have changed since

619
00:25:27,110 --> 00:25:24,159
the 1950s so i write down what i want

620
00:25:29,830 --> 00:25:27,120
their subconscious to go to and then i

621
00:25:32,710 --> 00:25:29,840
have to make a decision well what number

622
00:25:36,710 --> 00:25:32,720
should i use to give to them to pair

623
00:25:38,789 --> 00:25:36,720
with that so there's different practices

624
00:25:41,029 --> 00:25:38,799
for this now i could just come up with

625
00:25:43,830 --> 00:25:41,039
any number just at the top of my mind or

626
00:25:44,950 --> 00:25:43,840
i could use a random number generator

627
00:25:46,630 --> 00:25:44,960
generally

628
00:25:49,029 --> 00:25:46,640
you could use any number i mean i could

629
00:25:50,870 --> 00:25:49,039
just call it target number one but

630
00:25:53,510 --> 00:25:50,880
because there's been so many target

631
00:25:56,070 --> 00:25:53,520
number ones in the world i might choose

632
00:25:58,310 --> 00:25:56,080
to have like eight digits

633
00:26:00,710 --> 00:25:58,320
and i personally like to

634
00:26:02,230 --> 00:26:00,720
um have some meaning attached to it so

635
00:26:03,990 --> 00:26:02,240
what i did was

636
00:26:06,070 --> 00:26:04,000
and actually i'd never done this before

637
00:26:08,470 --> 00:26:06,080
but i went online and looked up codes

638
00:26:12,310 --> 00:26:08,480
like different kinds of codes and then i

639
00:26:14,630 --> 00:26:12,320
put the words find the money and then i

640
00:26:16,789 --> 00:26:14,640
put the words find the money into the

641
00:26:18,710 --> 00:26:16,799
code generator and it gave me a string

642
00:26:21,510 --> 00:26:18,720
of numbers and then i chose the first

643
00:26:23,750 --> 00:26:21,520
eight numbers and so i'm get i i used

644
00:26:26,070 --> 00:26:23,760
those numbers and gave them to the

645
00:26:28,310 --> 00:26:26,080
viewers now some other project managers

646
00:26:30,390 --> 00:26:28,320
they might use just a date like the date

647
00:26:32,789 --> 00:26:30,400
that the project is due

648
00:26:35,590 --> 00:26:32,799
but then i sometimes i don't like to do

649
00:26:37,990 --> 00:26:35,600
dates so much just because i i think

650
00:26:40,149 --> 00:26:38,000
well maybe the date will confuse people

651
00:26:43,029 --> 00:26:40,159
so another thing you could do is

652
00:26:45,269 --> 00:26:43,039
longitude latitude coordinates but then

653
00:26:46,950 --> 00:26:45,279
just take some numbers just in case

654
00:26:50,070 --> 00:26:46,960
anyone might like try to put the

655
00:26:51,830 --> 00:26:50,080
longitude latitude number into the into

656
00:26:53,990 --> 00:26:51,840
google earth and try to look for it

657
00:26:55,909 --> 00:26:54,000
right so the string i think the numbers

658
00:26:58,390 --> 00:26:55,919
are usually somewhere around 10 digits

659
00:27:01,430 --> 00:26:58,400
or 12 digits so i'll take like four

660
00:27:03,269 --> 00:27:01,440
digits from one four from the other mix

661
00:27:05,110 --> 00:27:03,279
them up and then just put them on a

662
00:27:07,110 --> 00:27:05,120
piece of paper and again none of that

663
00:27:10,630 --> 00:27:07,120
may be necessary because this really

664
00:27:13,190 --> 00:27:10,640
does seem to work through intention so

665
00:27:15,430 --> 00:27:13,200
and again i'm just giving the numbers it

666
00:27:16,789 --> 00:27:15,440
to the viewers so they have something

667
00:27:19,510 --> 00:27:16,799
that they can

668
00:27:22,310 --> 00:27:19,520
they can hone in on so they can connect

669
00:27:24,389 --> 00:27:22,320
with and and some of the methods involve

670
00:27:26,789 --> 00:27:24,399
writing the target number on the paper

671
00:27:28,870 --> 00:27:26,799
and then tracing the target number with

672
00:27:31,269 --> 00:27:28,880
your fingers or your pen

673
00:27:32,710 --> 00:27:31,279
or or doing what's called an ideogram

674
00:27:35,269 --> 00:27:32,720
where you write the numbers and you just

675
00:27:37,990 --> 00:27:35,279
let your hand make a reflexive mark and

676
00:27:40,070 --> 00:27:38,000
then you touch that so

677
00:27:43,510 --> 00:27:40,080
we're looking for a way to

678
00:27:45,950 --> 00:27:43,520
bring the the body into contact with the

679
00:27:50,149 --> 00:27:45,960
target number the target number being a

680
00:27:52,710 --> 00:27:50,159
representation of the whole target

681
00:27:54,149 --> 00:27:52,720
and there are should someone

682
00:27:56,470 --> 00:27:54,159
so sorry i was going i was just going to

683
00:27:58,310 --> 00:27:56,480
ask deborah what should someone consider

684
00:28:00,310 --> 00:27:58,320
success especially when they're first

685
00:28:03,110 --> 00:28:00,320
starting out and they're first trying a

686
00:28:05,269 --> 00:28:03,120
set of target numbers now if you pick

687
00:28:07,269 --> 00:28:05,279
you know the eiffel tower you're not

688
00:28:09,190 --> 00:28:07,279
looking for i'm sure the grand detail of

689
00:28:10,789 --> 00:28:09,200
the tower and surroundings what what

690
00:28:12,310 --> 00:28:10,799
sorts of things would you be looking for

691
00:28:14,630 --> 00:28:12,320
to think there's definitely something

692
00:28:17,510 --> 00:28:14,640
there and that's been successful

693
00:28:20,710 --> 00:28:17,520
yeah well this is where sketching really

694
00:28:24,470 --> 00:28:20,720
helps like i would always set the rule

695
00:28:26,389 --> 00:28:24,480
that if anyone is doing any kind of task

696
00:28:29,830 --> 00:28:26,399
related to describing something

697
00:28:31,510 --> 00:28:29,840
physically like the eiffel target eiffel

698
00:28:33,510 --> 00:28:31,520
tower they're not going to know that's

699
00:28:36,310 --> 00:28:33,520
what it is but they just know there's a

700
00:28:38,710 --> 00:28:36,320
location so they need to sketch as soon

701
00:28:41,590 --> 00:28:38,720
as you get an impression of a shape you

702
00:28:43,590 --> 00:28:41,600
have to sketch the shape and so this

703
00:28:46,310 --> 00:28:43,600
would be very easy for even brand new

704
00:28:48,950 --> 00:28:46,320
people as soon as they get any image

705
00:28:52,789 --> 00:28:48,960
that that could be sketched they sketch

706
00:28:55,669 --> 00:28:52,799
it and then so if i wanted to be

707
00:28:56,789 --> 00:28:55,679
relatively certain that a person was

708
00:28:59,669 --> 00:28:56,799
actually

709
00:29:02,070 --> 00:28:59,679
describing that i would expect it to be

710
00:29:04,310 --> 00:29:02,080
in a triangle shape you know i would

711
00:29:07,029 --> 00:29:04,320
expect this sketch to at least

712
00:29:08,630 --> 00:29:07,039
resemble because that's such a

713
00:29:10,549 --> 00:29:08,640
particular

714
00:29:12,549 --> 00:29:10,559
singular

715
00:29:14,630 --> 00:29:12,559
structure right there you know other

716
00:29:17,830 --> 00:29:14,640
locations have many different shapes and

717
00:29:21,590 --> 00:29:17,840
things going on but that shape like you

718
00:29:23,750 --> 00:29:21,600
everyone knows what that looks like so i

719
00:29:26,870 --> 00:29:23,760
would expect that they would have a

720
00:29:29,590 --> 00:29:26,880
sketch that would look uh at least in

721
00:29:32,149 --> 00:29:29,600
the the overall shape i would also

722
00:29:34,149 --> 00:29:32,159
expect that they like filled it in with

723
00:29:36,149 --> 00:29:34,159
some lines or

724
00:29:38,950 --> 00:29:36,159
something tower like

725
00:29:41,350 --> 00:29:38,960
and also even to maybe say the word um

726
00:29:45,190 --> 00:29:41,360
you know tower tall

727
00:29:47,909 --> 00:29:45,200
um narrow at the top taper tapered going

728
00:29:50,230 --> 00:29:47,919
wider so descriptions like that and that

729
00:29:53,590 --> 00:29:50,240
that's not something that's a target

730
00:29:56,070 --> 00:29:53,600
that would be very easy for for even

731
00:29:58,470 --> 00:29:56,080
someone doing this very first time to

732
00:30:01,110 --> 00:29:58,480
describe so if i wanted to have any

733
00:30:03,590 --> 00:30:01,120
confidence that that would be the level

734
00:30:06,230 --> 00:30:03,600
that i would expect

735
00:30:07,350 --> 00:30:06,240
but you know i wouldn't if if this was a

736
00:30:10,870 --> 00:30:07,360
test

737
00:30:12,549 --> 00:30:10,880
of can the person really um you know do

738
00:30:13,909 --> 00:30:12,559
they have psychic abilities or can they

739
00:30:16,149 --> 00:30:13,919
really do this

740
00:30:18,630 --> 00:30:16,159
i wouldn't choose eiffel tower just

741
00:30:21,430 --> 00:30:18,640
because someone might accuse us of like

742
00:30:23,110 --> 00:30:21,440
oh they might that's such a famous place

743
00:30:25,590 --> 00:30:23,120
and we know that other remote viewers

744
00:30:28,630 --> 00:30:25,600
have described that so

745
00:30:31,029 --> 00:30:28,640
i wouldn't even choose that as a target

746
00:30:32,789 --> 00:30:31,039
because skeptics could just disregard

747
00:30:34,549 --> 00:30:32,799
that as you know well maybe they

748
00:30:36,149 --> 00:30:34,559
logically thought that was going to be

749
00:30:37,510 --> 00:30:36,159
chosen

750
00:30:39,190 --> 00:30:37,520
some of the most common questions that

751
00:30:41,029 --> 00:30:39,200
were sent over to me by listeners we're

752
00:30:42,950 --> 00:30:41,039
not getting to those just yet but i want

753
00:30:45,269 --> 00:30:42,960
to find out what are some of the most

754
00:30:48,870 --> 00:30:45,279
intriguing things you yourself have

755
00:30:53,590 --> 00:30:52,789
okay so most intriguing

756
00:30:54,870 --> 00:30:53,600
well

757
00:30:57,430 --> 00:30:54,880
you know

758
00:31:01,110 --> 00:30:57,440
let's see because i have to separate out

759
00:31:02,830 --> 00:31:01,120
what are the most interesting targets or

760
00:31:06,789 --> 00:31:02,840
ideas of targets

761
00:31:09,669 --> 00:31:06,799
versus my most interesting experiences

762
00:31:12,630 --> 00:31:09,679
i've had with targets and the two are

763
00:31:14,549 --> 00:31:12,640
really somewhat different you know for

764
00:31:16,549 --> 00:31:14,559
for me what's most

765
00:31:19,830 --> 00:31:16,559
interesting is when i do have more of

766
00:31:22,070 --> 00:31:19,840
that full body experience like i was

767
00:31:24,070 --> 00:31:22,080
tasked with a target

768
00:31:25,669 --> 00:31:24,080
that it i i don't even quite remember

769
00:31:29,190 --> 00:31:25,679
what it was it was somewhere in the

770
00:31:31,750 --> 00:31:29,200
middle east and it was a building but

771
00:31:34,149 --> 00:31:31,760
before i got to the building i had this

772
00:31:38,070 --> 00:31:34,159
image as if i was moving over

773
00:31:41,430 --> 00:31:38,080
sand and a desert and i saw every single

774
00:31:44,470 --> 00:31:41,440
grain of sand as i was moving through

775
00:31:46,149 --> 00:31:44,480
and i saw like the sand part and then a

776
00:31:48,549 --> 00:31:46,159
scorpion

777
00:31:50,950 --> 00:31:48,559
exited this hole and it was like i could

778
00:31:53,909 --> 00:31:50,960
see all the sunlight and feel the heat

779
00:31:56,230 --> 00:31:53,919
and moving fast over it and it was so

780
00:31:57,909 --> 00:31:56,240
cool i got stuck there and i never

781
00:32:00,389 --> 00:31:57,919
actually described the building i was

782
00:32:02,389 --> 00:32:00,399
supposed to describe so

783
00:32:04,230 --> 00:32:02,399
that but for me that was even though

784
00:32:07,590 --> 00:32:04,240
we're just talking about some grains of

785
00:32:09,750 --> 00:32:07,600
sand that really stands out as such a

786
00:32:11,430 --> 00:32:09,760
cool experience but in terms of

787
00:32:13,190 --> 00:32:11,440
interesting targets

788
00:32:15,750 --> 00:32:13,200
i i recently

789
00:32:16,950 --> 00:32:15,760
maybe about six months ago

790
00:32:18,549 --> 00:32:16,960
did a

791
00:32:21,830 --> 00:32:18,559
a couple

792
00:32:23,830 --> 00:32:21,840
sessions for skinwalker ranch

793
00:32:25,750 --> 00:32:23,840
so that was interesting if you're

794
00:32:28,950 --> 00:32:25,760
familiar i would think you're familiar

795
00:32:30,230 --> 00:32:28,960
with skinwalker ranch yeah yeah very yep

796
00:32:32,389 --> 00:32:30,240
and um

797
00:32:36,310 --> 00:32:32,399
specifically looking into the cattle

798
00:32:38,789 --> 00:32:36,320
mutilation so that was quite interesting

799
00:32:40,630 --> 00:32:38,799
it was a yeah a little could you expand

800
00:32:42,470 --> 00:32:40,640
on that yeah

801
00:32:46,310 --> 00:32:42,480
yeah well

802
00:32:49,590 --> 00:32:46,320
so i was and that was a target where for

803
00:32:53,750 --> 00:32:49,600
this particular one i did know up front

804
00:32:55,909 --> 00:32:53,760
what it was the i was tasked by it by a

805
00:32:58,310 --> 00:32:55,919
someone who's been involved in mufon for

806
00:33:01,590 --> 00:32:58,320
many years one of the board of directors

807
00:33:03,269 --> 00:33:01,600
and he was interested to see what we

808
00:33:06,070 --> 00:33:03,279
would come up with

809
00:33:07,669 --> 00:33:06,080
in terms of remote viewing but he did

810
00:33:09,190 --> 00:33:07,679
want us to

811
00:33:11,029 --> 00:33:09,200
know what we were going to do just

812
00:33:13,430 --> 00:33:11,039
ethically you don't want to give remote

813
00:33:15,830 --> 00:33:13,440
viewers things that could potentially

814
00:33:18,870 --> 00:33:15,840
be dangerous to look at so

815
00:33:19,669 --> 00:33:18,880
you know i i was nervous about it just

816
00:33:29,350 --> 00:33:19,679
in

817
00:33:32,470 --> 00:33:29,360
concluded as far as the cattle

818
00:33:34,870 --> 00:33:32,480
mutilations but what i experienced was i

819
00:33:37,269 --> 00:33:34,880
i did one session totally fine no

820
00:33:39,830 --> 00:33:37,279
problem i got more and more comfortable

821
00:33:43,269 --> 00:33:39,840
i did another session drew like a map of

822
00:33:46,470 --> 00:33:43,279
the area and then on the third day i was

823
00:33:48,789 --> 00:33:46,480
just writing everything up and i was

824
00:33:51,029 --> 00:33:48,799
writing a summary of my experiences and

825
00:33:53,990 --> 00:33:51,039
i was about to be done and i and then i

826
00:33:57,110 --> 00:33:54,000
thought you know i i just feel like i

827
00:34:00,950 --> 00:33:57,120
haven't yet tuned in to like really

828
00:34:03,590 --> 00:34:00,960
gotten clearly who is behind all of this

829
00:34:07,350 --> 00:34:03,600
and when i had that thought

830
00:34:09,589 --> 00:34:07,360
i had this pain shoot through my head

831
00:34:12,230 --> 00:34:09,599
that was so it felt like my head had

832
00:34:13,829 --> 00:34:12,240
just almost exploded i like i thought i

833
00:34:16,149 --> 00:34:13,839
was gonna have to go to the hospital and

834
00:34:19,270 --> 00:34:16,159
it was like it didn't last long it only

835
00:34:22,869 --> 00:34:19,280
lasted for about a minute but it was so

836
00:34:25,270 --> 00:34:22,879
intense i i was almost screaming and at

837
00:34:27,909 --> 00:34:25,280
that point i was like you know what i'm

838
00:34:30,149 --> 00:34:27,919
done i and i hate being dead like if i

839
00:34:33,750 --> 00:34:30,159
feel like i haven't gotten to something

840
00:34:36,470 --> 00:34:33,760
i will go for like 20 more hours but

841
00:34:37,270 --> 00:34:36,480
i was done with that but what i felt

842
00:34:40,389 --> 00:34:37,280
like

843
00:34:43,030 --> 00:34:40,399
might be most interesting to people is

844
00:34:44,470 --> 00:34:43,040
that i've i got a sense that there's

845
00:34:46,149 --> 00:34:44,480
something

846
00:34:48,629 --> 00:34:46,159
under the ground

847
00:34:50,629 --> 00:34:48,639
and there there's something in the the

848
00:34:52,550 --> 00:34:50,639
earth in the dirt there there's

849
00:34:55,510 --> 00:34:52,560
something that

850
00:34:58,470 --> 00:34:55,520
whoever is behind the cattle mutilations

851
00:35:01,910 --> 00:34:58,480
they want to test what's actually in the

852
00:35:05,030 --> 00:35:01,920
land and so but it will only show up in

853
00:35:08,310 --> 00:35:05,040
the tissue of the cows so it's not like

854
00:35:10,150 --> 00:35:08,320
they can just um just go and test the

855
00:35:12,390 --> 00:35:10,160
the dirt themselves

856
00:35:13,430 --> 00:35:12,400
somehow what they're looking for is

857
00:35:15,910 --> 00:35:13,440
within

858
00:35:18,630 --> 00:35:15,920
the the body of the animal the tissue

859
00:35:21,750 --> 00:35:18,640
and so they have to take out this tissue

860
00:35:24,790 --> 00:35:21,760
that is going to help them know what is

861
00:35:26,230 --> 00:35:24,800
what is under there so it's some kind of

862
00:35:28,790 --> 00:35:26,240
valuable

863
00:35:30,870 --> 00:35:28,800
resource that they're testing that they

864
00:35:32,550 --> 00:35:30,880
don't want anyone to know

865
00:35:35,750 --> 00:35:32,560
is is there

866
00:35:37,430 --> 00:35:35,760
um as far as what it is i i don't

867
00:35:39,750 --> 00:35:37,440
remember i did get like different

868
00:35:41,750 --> 00:35:39,760
characteristics of it and i'd have to go

869
00:35:45,270 --> 00:35:41,760
look back at that

870
00:35:46,630 --> 00:35:45,280
but that was my sense and i i did in

871
00:35:49,710 --> 00:35:46,640
terms of

872
00:35:52,150 --> 00:35:49,720
i felt like these were kind of like

873
00:35:53,109 --> 00:35:52,160
paramilitary people but they weren't

874
00:35:55,990 --> 00:35:53,119
really

875
00:35:57,910 --> 00:35:56,000
with the us government but they they had

876
00:36:02,230 --> 00:35:57,920
a very much

877
00:36:04,470 --> 00:36:02,240
military hierarchical field to them but

878
00:36:07,990 --> 00:36:04,480
they weren't just part of the regular

879
00:36:12,069 --> 00:36:10,069
can i ask deborah do you know who thomas

880
00:36:14,230 --> 00:36:12,079
winterton is in relation to skinwalker

881
00:36:16,310 --> 00:36:14,240
ranch

882
00:36:17,990 --> 00:36:16,320
no i don't

883
00:36:19,829 --> 00:36:18,000
well it's really interesting you

884
00:36:22,390 --> 00:36:19,839
describe the pain in your head thomas

885
00:36:24,550 --> 00:36:22,400
winterton is the ranch superintendent

886
00:36:26,150 --> 00:36:24,560
that works on skinwalker ranch now he's

887
00:36:28,150 --> 00:36:26,160
on the tv show and i've interviewed him

888
00:36:31,270 --> 00:36:28,160
on the podcast he's a really nice guy

889
00:36:33,750 --> 00:36:31,280
but um he had um a physical ailment from

890
00:36:36,150 --> 00:36:33,760
the ranch where he was doing some

891
00:36:38,550 --> 00:36:36,160
digging as you can i mentioned about

892
00:36:40,069 --> 00:36:38,560
things being under the ranch and he

893
00:36:42,390 --> 00:36:40,079
ended up with a really strange injury

894
00:36:43,670 --> 00:36:42,400
that medically they couldn't explain

895
00:36:46,069 --> 00:36:43,680
where the

896
00:36:47,270 --> 00:36:46,079
the a layer of fluid developed between

897
00:36:49,829 --> 00:36:47,280
his skull

898
00:36:51,589 --> 00:36:49,839
and the skin and expanded to a point

899
00:36:53,910 --> 00:36:51,599
where he was getting excruciating

900
00:36:55,829 --> 00:36:53,920
headaches um and he went and then the

901
00:36:57,190 --> 00:36:55,839
doctors couldn't explain what this was

902
00:36:59,510 --> 00:36:57,200
he was sent off the ranch and it's

903
00:37:01,430 --> 00:36:59,520
happened a couple of times um where he's

904
00:37:03,430 --> 00:37:01,440
got these really intense pains in his

905
00:37:04,950 --> 00:37:03,440
head so that was just really interesting

906
00:37:06,470 --> 00:37:04,960
that you mentioned that something you

907
00:37:09,910 --> 00:37:06,480
sort of experienced

908
00:37:11,990 --> 00:37:09,920
yeah wow that is really interesting yeah

909
00:37:14,550 --> 00:37:12,000
it's kind of scary because it almost

910
00:37:17,030 --> 00:37:14,560
felt like something was actually going

911
00:37:19,030 --> 00:37:17,040
on in my head at the moment like

912
00:37:21,030 --> 00:37:19,040
that did scare me even talking about it

913
00:37:22,630 --> 00:37:21,040
right now like my head's starting to

914
00:37:25,190 --> 00:37:22,640
hurt a little bit

915
00:37:27,589 --> 00:37:25,200
too can i can i also ask deborah do you

916
00:37:30,069 --> 00:37:27,599
worry that there's there's talk with the

917
00:37:32,150 --> 00:37:30,079
whole phenomenon uh if we umbrella the

918
00:37:34,550 --> 00:37:32,160
whole subject to ufos aliens remote

919
00:37:37,030 --> 00:37:34,560
viewing everything in between that there

920
00:37:38,630 --> 00:37:37,040
is somewhat of a sticky portfolio is the

921
00:37:41,670 --> 00:37:38,640
wording that is sometimes used or a

922
00:37:43,589 --> 00:37:41,680
hitchhiker effect and george knapp when

923
00:37:46,069 --> 00:37:43,599
i interviewed him discussed that after

924
00:37:48,150 --> 00:37:46,079
his time on skinwalker ranch he felt

925
00:37:50,230 --> 00:37:48,160
something followed him off the ranch

926
00:37:53,109 --> 00:37:50,240
thomas winterton and even government

927
00:37:55,670 --> 00:37:53,119
officials have reported that something a

928
00:37:58,310 --> 00:37:55,680
presence an entity have has followed

929
00:38:00,390 --> 00:37:58,320
them off of the ranch is that something

930
00:38:03,270 --> 00:38:00,400
that either you have experienced or you

931
00:38:05,589 --> 00:38:03,280
worry about when you remote view an area

932
00:38:08,630 --> 00:38:05,599
or subject like this

933
00:38:10,870 --> 00:38:08,640
yes i would be worried about it and

934
00:38:13,829 --> 00:38:10,880
it's interesting you know

935
00:38:15,510 --> 00:38:13,839
where i experienced that have you

936
00:38:16,950 --> 00:38:15,520
heard of

937
00:38:19,430 --> 00:38:16,960
east seti

938
00:38:21,750 --> 00:38:19,440
as the east city or c said in washington

939
00:38:23,510 --> 00:38:21,760
state

940
00:38:25,510 --> 00:38:23,520
and i'm forgetting

941
00:38:27,589 --> 00:38:25,520
what is the guy's name who

942
00:38:29,990 --> 00:38:27,599
runs that

943
00:38:30,950 --> 00:38:30,000
it'll come to me but it's in washington

944
00:38:34,390 --> 00:38:30,960
state

945
00:38:37,430 --> 00:38:34,400
and it's right near mount adams

946
00:38:40,230 --> 00:38:37,440
and it's a retreat center and you might

947
00:38:43,109 --> 00:38:40,240
know john vavanco he's a remote viewing

948
00:38:45,270 --> 00:38:43,119
instructor and he had a retreat out

949
00:38:47,190 --> 00:38:45,280
there a couple years ago and so i went

950
00:38:49,109 --> 00:38:47,200
to that along with some of my friends

951
00:38:51,190 --> 00:38:49,119
and they had different events going on

952
00:38:55,030 --> 00:38:51,200
and you just it's a beautiful place you

953
00:38:57,190 --> 00:38:55,040
camp out there and but they they are

954
00:38:59,589 --> 00:38:57,200
constantly having

955
00:39:02,390 --> 00:38:59,599
sightings ufo sightings and all sorts of

956
00:39:05,910 --> 00:39:02,400
weird things going on there and you know

957
00:39:08,710 --> 00:39:05,920
i was rather skeptical because again i

958
00:39:10,870 --> 00:39:08,720
i observed people there who were seeing

959
00:39:13,109 --> 00:39:10,880
lights in the sky and immediately

960
00:39:14,870 --> 00:39:13,119
assuming that they're ufos

961
00:39:18,069 --> 00:39:14,880
where i'm i'm

962
00:39:20,310 --> 00:39:18,079
i have my own airplane a cessna 172 and

963
00:39:22,630 --> 00:39:20,320
my husband's a pilot and i'm his

964
00:39:25,510 --> 00:39:22,640
navigator co-pilot so we spend a lot of

965
00:39:27,349 --> 00:39:25,520
time up in that air and i know how busy

966
00:39:29,750 --> 00:39:27,359
it is up there you know there are so

967
00:39:32,310 --> 00:39:29,760
many things flying on around at any

968
00:39:35,589 --> 00:39:32,320
given time so to just see lights in the

969
00:39:37,670 --> 00:39:35,599
sky and assume that they are ufos is

970
00:39:39,750 --> 00:39:37,680
just you know that that kind of bugs me

971
00:39:41,349 --> 00:39:39,760
and and i felt like i saw that a lot

972
00:39:44,069 --> 00:39:41,359
with the people that were there they'd

973
00:39:46,470 --> 00:39:44,079
get excited about that but i have to say

974
00:39:49,510 --> 00:39:46,480
so so one night i was receiving a

975
00:39:51,829 --> 00:39:49,520
massage from actually john vavanco's

976
00:39:53,910 --> 00:39:51,839
wife at the time she brooke she was

977
00:39:55,829 --> 00:39:53,920
giving me a massage and as i was just

978
00:39:58,310 --> 00:39:55,839
laying there and it was in this like

979
00:40:00,870 --> 00:39:58,320
pyramidal structure

980
00:40:02,470 --> 00:40:00,880
where the owner has like his office or

981
00:40:04,710 --> 00:40:02,480
his meditation center and there's

982
00:40:07,270 --> 00:40:04,720
massage up above and as i was lying

983
00:40:09,030 --> 00:40:07,280
there i was seeing the weirdest images

984
00:40:11,670 --> 00:40:09,040
like i'm just laying there and i would

985
00:40:15,670 --> 00:40:11,680
just clairvoyantly but like in

986
00:40:18,069 --> 00:40:15,680
technicolor just these weird faces and

987
00:40:20,790 --> 00:40:18,079
like i wouldn't say those looked alien

988
00:40:22,710 --> 00:40:20,800
they just look like half human half dog

989
00:40:25,109 --> 00:40:22,720
just very like

990
00:40:27,829 --> 00:40:25,119
combinations of animal people looking

991
00:40:30,309 --> 00:40:27,839
things so that was really weird and then

992
00:40:33,190 --> 00:40:30,319
i went home from i was there for about

993
00:40:35,670 --> 00:40:33,200
three days camping out and i went home

994
00:40:37,670 --> 00:40:35,680
and the first night i was lying there

995
00:40:41,349 --> 00:40:37,680
and i started just hearing this

996
00:40:44,470 --> 00:40:41,359
profanity like being yelled out at me

997
00:40:46,390 --> 00:40:44,480
and you know it it just it's in my ears

998
00:40:48,069 --> 00:40:46,400
so it wasn't on the outside so it was

999
00:40:50,630 --> 00:40:48,079
telepathically but you know i don't

1000
00:40:52,390 --> 00:40:50,640
usually have that kind of language like

1001
00:40:54,550 --> 00:40:52,400
just running through my head

1002
00:40:56,870 --> 00:40:54,560
and then just again those images like

1003
00:41:00,550 --> 00:40:56,880
one after another like you know faces

1004
00:41:01,910 --> 00:41:00,560
just coming flying at you

1005
00:41:04,870 --> 00:41:01,920
at me and

1006
00:41:07,270 --> 00:41:04,880
so that i would say um i

1007
00:41:09,990 --> 00:41:07,280
i was sure that i had picked up some

1008
00:41:12,550 --> 00:41:10,000
stuff from there and i would say that

1009
00:41:15,349 --> 00:41:12,560
continued for about a week i had to do i

1010
00:41:17,430 --> 00:41:15,359
did meditations i did healings on myself

1011
00:41:19,910 --> 00:41:17,440
i had i have so many friends and

1012
00:41:23,109 --> 00:41:19,920
students who are healers so i had them

1013
00:41:25,510 --> 00:41:23,119
work on me and i'm someone where i i

1014
00:41:28,309 --> 00:41:25,520
believe that yes you have to psychically

1015
00:41:30,069 --> 00:41:28,319
protect yourself and clear yourself at

1016
00:41:32,390 --> 00:41:30,079
the same time

1017
00:41:35,190 --> 00:41:32,400
a lot of times people's fear of these

1018
00:41:37,510 --> 00:41:35,200
things create a whole lot more problems

1019
00:41:39,750 --> 00:41:37,520
than the things themselves you know so

1020
00:41:41,349 --> 00:41:39,760
it's just like anything else sometimes

1021
00:41:44,309 --> 00:41:41,359
you know you've got an obnoxious

1022
00:41:45,910 --> 00:41:44,319
neighbor or you've got you know

1023
00:41:47,670 --> 00:41:45,920
you have an argument with someone and

1024
00:41:50,150 --> 00:41:47,680
you got to just kind of clear that up i

1025
00:41:51,270 --> 00:41:50,160
look at the same thing i don't want to

1026
00:41:53,750 --> 00:41:51,280
get

1027
00:41:56,150 --> 00:41:53,760
dramatic or upset about these things but

1028
00:41:58,630 --> 00:41:56,160
in that case i would say it took me a

1029
00:42:00,710 --> 00:41:58,640
good week to 10 days to just clear that

1030
00:42:02,710 --> 00:42:00,720
out where it stopped happening and

1031
00:42:04,390 --> 00:42:02,720
thankfully though like i you know again

1032
00:42:07,109 --> 00:42:04,400
i've been doing this for over two

1033
00:42:11,670 --> 00:42:07,119
decades so i can be aware when that kind

1034
00:42:13,910 --> 00:42:11,680
of stuff happens but if if i wasn't and

1035
00:42:16,309 --> 00:42:13,920
just i suddenly started like hearing

1036
00:42:18,550 --> 00:42:16,319
profanity or you know having these

1037
00:42:20,550 --> 00:42:18,560
thoughts in my head i might think it was

1038
00:42:22,230 --> 00:42:20,560
you know just me or that there's

1039
00:42:24,550 --> 00:42:22,240
something wrong with me or i'm going

1040
00:42:27,589 --> 00:42:24,560
crazy but because i know these are not

1041
00:42:30,710 --> 00:42:27,599
typical things that happen to me you

1042
00:42:33,270 --> 00:42:30,720
know there's something going on so for

1043
00:42:35,349 --> 00:42:33,280
that reason like i'm not going back to

1044
00:42:37,430 --> 00:42:35,359
that ranch even though some of my it was

1045
00:42:39,430 --> 00:42:37,440
fun and you know some of my friends have

1046
00:42:41,349 --> 00:42:39,440
invited me to other events but i'm just

1047
00:42:43,030 --> 00:42:41,359
like no there there's

1048
00:42:45,349 --> 00:42:43,040
there's something wrong there and i and

1049
00:42:46,390 --> 00:42:45,359
i know that actually one night when we

1050
00:42:48,950 --> 00:42:46,400
were there

1051
00:42:51,270 --> 00:42:48,960
about four different people had really

1052
00:42:53,750 --> 00:42:51,280
bad nightmares and and a couple of the

1053
00:42:56,470 --> 00:42:53,760
guys woke up in the middle of the night

1054
00:42:59,829 --> 00:42:56,480
including the owner his name is james i

1055
00:43:01,670 --> 00:42:59,839
think um shoot it'll come to me but that

1056
00:43:04,470 --> 00:43:01,680
the guys got up and did some kind of

1057
00:43:06,710 --> 00:43:04,480
ceremony because they all and one did

1058
00:43:08,309 --> 00:43:06,720
see flashing lights outside of his tent

1059
00:43:09,750 --> 00:43:08,319
but again i wasn't sure maybe it was

1060
00:43:12,870 --> 00:43:09,760
just someone going to the bathroom with

1061
00:43:15,030 --> 00:43:12,880
a flashlight but they but but they had

1062
00:43:17,589 --> 00:43:15,040
like a shared dream of like really

1063
00:43:20,390 --> 00:43:17,599
disturbing things in the dream and so

1064
00:43:22,630 --> 00:43:20,400
they got up and did a ceremony and you

1065
00:43:24,829 --> 00:43:22,640
know felt like that helped i wasn't part

1066
00:43:27,190 --> 00:43:24,839
of that i just heard about it the next

1067
00:43:28,550 --> 00:43:27,200
morning that's really interesting i i

1068
00:43:30,710 --> 00:43:28,560
don't blame you for not wanting to

1069
00:43:32,870 --> 00:43:30,720
experience that again and it's a lot to

1070
00:43:35,109 --> 00:43:32,880
take on for yourself emotionally and

1071
00:43:36,390 --> 00:43:35,119
physically listen i do want to get on to

1072
00:43:37,750 --> 00:43:36,400
the book as well because i've got a

1073
00:43:40,550 --> 00:43:37,760
whole lot of questions to get to from

1074
00:43:42,790 --> 00:43:40,560
listeners now um the book is released or

1075
00:43:45,589 --> 00:43:42,800
was released on the 25th of august and

1076
00:43:47,829 --> 00:43:45,599
it's called associative uh associative

1077
00:43:50,230 --> 00:43:47,839
remote viewing the art and science of

1078
00:43:53,030 --> 00:43:50,240
predicting outcomes for sports politics

1079
00:43:54,309 --> 00:43:53,040
finances and the lottery now that is

1080
00:43:56,230 --> 00:43:54,319
going to raise some eyebrows straight

1081
00:43:58,390 --> 00:43:56,240
away for people looking to make a quick

1082
00:44:00,230 --> 00:43:58,400
buck as well i'm sure um and that's a

1083
00:44:02,630 --> 00:44:00,240
good one for the search engines so it

1084
00:44:04,470 --> 00:44:02,640
was written by yourself john knowles and

1085
00:44:05,910 --> 00:44:04,480
others are attributed to it do you want

1086
00:44:07,990 --> 00:44:05,920
to talk a little bit about what the

1087
00:44:08,870 --> 00:44:08,000
book's about deborah

1088
00:44:12,390 --> 00:44:08,880
sure

1089
00:44:14,470 --> 00:44:12,400
well it is just about that using

1090
00:44:17,030 --> 00:44:14,480
your psychic abilities to be able to

1091
00:44:18,870 --> 00:44:17,040
predict future outcomes and they could

1092
00:44:21,349 --> 00:44:18,880
be outcomes for

1093
00:44:23,829 --> 00:44:21,359
the stock market for cryptocurrency for

1094
00:44:24,790 --> 00:44:23,839
horse racing for football games soccer

1095
00:44:27,990 --> 00:44:24,800
games

1096
00:44:31,270 --> 00:44:28,000
uh just anything that you would want to

1097
00:44:33,190 --> 00:44:31,280
be able to predict including including

1098
00:44:34,870 --> 00:44:33,200
getting lotto numbers

1099
00:44:37,510 --> 00:44:34,880
so

1100
00:44:40,950 --> 00:44:37,520
and really this book is a

1101
00:44:43,589 --> 00:44:40,960
historical overview and it is some

1102
00:44:45,190 --> 00:44:43,599
people are calling it like a tristi or a

1103
00:44:47,349 --> 00:44:45,200
manifesto

1104
00:44:50,390 --> 00:44:47,359
because it's almost 800 pages long and

1105
00:44:53,990 --> 00:44:50,400
it covers not just what was done in the

1106
00:44:57,510 --> 00:44:54,000
in the way past but a lot of what people

1107
00:44:59,910 --> 00:44:57,520
are doing these days in these areas so a

1108
00:45:02,230 --> 00:44:59,920
lot of people new to this don't realize

1109
00:45:04,790 --> 00:45:02,240
how much is happening where there's

1110
00:45:06,710 --> 00:45:04,800
groups of people both individuals and

1111
00:45:09,589 --> 00:45:06,720
groups that work together

1112
00:45:12,069 --> 00:45:09,599
to very diligently and somewhat in a

1113
00:45:14,470 --> 00:45:12,079
scientific manner so some some are like

1114
00:45:16,550 --> 00:45:14,480
doing formal scientific research

1115
00:45:18,870 --> 00:45:16,560
projects in this area and those projects

1116
00:45:21,190 --> 00:45:18,880
are getting published in formal journals

1117
00:45:23,109 --> 00:45:21,200
and then others are they're they're not

1118
00:45:25,190 --> 00:45:23,119
going as far as

1119
00:45:27,270 --> 00:45:25,200
as like writing up their projects

1120
00:45:29,829 --> 00:45:27,280
formally but they get together they have

1121
00:45:32,870 --> 00:45:29,839
a plan they say how many trials they're

1122
00:45:36,710 --> 00:45:32,880
going to do and then they do repeated

1123
00:45:39,270 --> 00:45:36,720
attempts at using remote viewing to and

1124
00:45:42,150 --> 00:45:39,280
and other approaches that involve

1125
00:45:44,710 --> 00:45:42,160
psychic abilities in order to get

1126
00:45:47,829 --> 00:45:44,720
to have an advantage so that they can

1127
00:45:50,950 --> 00:45:47,839
make predictions and either win money or

1128
00:45:53,910 --> 00:45:50,960
just see how many hits they can get so a

1129
00:45:56,069 --> 00:45:53,920
lot of people involved in this are

1130
00:45:57,829 --> 00:45:56,079
some are very interested in

1131
00:46:00,630 --> 00:45:57,839
making money that's primarily why

1132
00:46:02,790 --> 00:46:00,640
they're into it but i would say

1133
00:46:04,630 --> 00:46:02,800
so many are just wanting to see what is

1134
00:46:07,030 --> 00:46:04,640
humanly possible with our psychic

1135
00:46:09,349 --> 00:46:07,040
abilities you know can we really even

1136
00:46:11,829 --> 00:46:09,359
tune into the future and can we do it

1137
00:46:15,270 --> 00:46:11,839
well enough so that we can find out

1138
00:46:17,349 --> 00:46:15,280
about an outcome before it happens and

1139
00:46:19,270 --> 00:46:17,359
so sometimes they're not wagering but

1140
00:46:22,230 --> 00:46:19,280
they're just recording their statistics

1141
00:46:23,990 --> 00:46:22,240
to try to get their numbers up

1142
00:46:25,750 --> 00:46:24,000
and there's different processes and see

1143
00:46:29,510 --> 00:46:25,760
one of the

1144
00:46:31,030 --> 00:46:29,520
the book deborah is very complimentary

1145
00:46:32,710 --> 00:46:31,040
it's a five-star review so it's going to

1146
00:46:34,470 --> 00:46:32,720
be but it also talks about the book

1147
00:46:37,030 --> 00:46:34,480
being an incredible introduction to the

1148
00:46:38,550 --> 00:46:37,040
subject for someone new to remote

1149
00:46:41,510 --> 00:46:38,560
viewing as well so that's obviously

1150
00:46:43,190 --> 00:46:41,520
really good can i can i just ask though

1151
00:46:45,270 --> 00:46:43,200
and again this maybe is a little bit of

1152
00:46:47,829 --> 00:46:45,280
biased from watching tv and movies over

1153
00:46:49,990 --> 00:46:47,839
the years as well you tend to find or i

1154
00:46:53,109 --> 00:46:50,000
see when a narrative is written about

1155
00:46:54,470 --> 00:46:53,119
this subject that it's almost a no-no to

1156
00:46:56,550 --> 00:46:54,480
morally

1157
00:46:58,150 --> 00:46:56,560
gain a profit from

1158
00:47:00,150 --> 00:46:58,160
things like this is that something

1159
00:47:01,750 --> 00:47:00,160
that's just not necessarily true and

1160
00:47:05,270 --> 00:47:01,760
there's nothing actually wrong with you

1161
00:47:07,030 --> 00:47:05,280
know predicting lottery numbers as such

1162
00:47:09,829 --> 00:47:07,040
yeah you know

1163
00:47:12,550 --> 00:47:09,839
i think we have to there's definitely

1164
00:47:14,870 --> 00:47:12,560
people who think that it

1165
00:47:17,190 --> 00:47:14,880
that when it comes to your intuitive

1166
00:47:19,030 --> 00:47:17,200
ability that's something spiritual and

1167
00:47:22,309 --> 00:47:19,040
so it's unethical

1168
00:47:24,950 --> 00:47:22,319
to to use these abilities for

1169
00:47:27,109 --> 00:47:24,960
financial gain or personal gain and

1170
00:47:29,750 --> 00:47:27,119
that's

1171
00:47:31,670 --> 00:47:29,760
you know people are entitled to their

1172
00:47:33,510 --> 00:47:31,680
beliefs but

1173
00:47:35,990 --> 00:47:33,520
on a couple levels

1174
00:47:36,950 --> 00:47:36,000
well first i believe that

1175
00:47:39,589 --> 00:47:36,960
that

1176
00:47:42,549 --> 00:47:39,599
everything we do is a gift you know

1177
00:47:45,430 --> 00:47:42,559
people are gifted with being able to

1178
00:47:48,069 --> 00:47:45,440
um do be accountants or architects or

1179
00:47:50,150 --> 00:47:48,079
athletes or artists or musicians or

1180
00:47:52,230 --> 00:47:50,160
singers you know

1181
00:47:54,470 --> 00:47:52,240
but but we don't have a problem that

1182
00:47:57,190 --> 00:47:54,480
someone who has a beautiful voice

1183
00:47:58,870 --> 00:47:57,200
and and then has trained to even develop

1184
00:48:01,349 --> 00:47:58,880
it further we don't have a problem that

1185
00:48:03,190 --> 00:48:01,359
they not even make money but some of

1186
00:48:05,670 --> 00:48:03,200
them are the richest people in our

1187
00:48:08,549 --> 00:48:05,680
society right same thing with people who

1188
00:48:11,349 --> 00:48:08,559
have sports abilities but how is that

1189
00:48:13,990 --> 00:48:11,359
not a gift from god you know but but

1190
00:48:16,230 --> 00:48:14,000
then our psychic abilities are somehow

1191
00:48:19,190 --> 00:48:16,240
different so i think these are

1192
00:48:22,390 --> 00:48:19,200
these are ideas that oftentimes come out

1193
00:48:24,390 --> 00:48:22,400
of religion specific religious or like

1194
00:48:26,309 --> 00:48:24,400
christian ideology

1195
00:48:29,270 --> 00:48:26,319
of what's and that when you when you

1196
00:48:30,870 --> 00:48:29,280
look into like who is against even

1197
00:48:34,069 --> 00:48:30,880
using psychic

1198
00:48:37,430 --> 00:48:34,079
abilities or even like the whole topic

1199
00:48:39,430 --> 00:48:37,440
yes you find like skeptics but you also

1200
00:48:41,430 --> 00:48:39,440
who call themselves scientists but

1201
00:48:43,829 --> 00:48:41,440
aren't like really being very scientific

1202
00:48:46,549 --> 00:48:43,839
about it if they're so opinionated and

1203
00:48:49,109 --> 00:48:46,559
then there are the real different

1204
00:48:51,589 --> 00:48:49,119
religious groups that say you know all

1205
00:48:54,230 --> 00:48:51,599
of this is the work of the devil or you

1206
00:48:57,829 --> 00:48:54,240
should only be always in service to to

1207
00:48:59,190 --> 00:48:57,839
people around these topics but um so

1208
00:49:01,670 --> 00:48:59,200
there's that

1209
00:49:02,870 --> 00:49:01,680
and then there's also the idea like i

1210
00:49:04,790 --> 00:49:02,880
look at it

1211
00:49:07,430 --> 00:49:04,800
as

1212
00:49:10,870 --> 00:49:07,440
we have we have our regular physical

1213
00:49:14,230 --> 00:49:10,880
senses like okay it's okay for me to

1214
00:49:16,950 --> 00:49:14,240
know things in life with using my eyes

1215
00:49:19,589 --> 00:49:16,960
and my ears that's okay but i can't use

1216
00:49:22,230 --> 00:49:19,599
the other aspects of myself to know

1217
00:49:24,549 --> 00:49:22,240
things like it almost makes me feel like

1218
00:49:26,630 --> 00:49:24,559
people would be saying oh well you know

1219
00:49:30,230 --> 00:49:26,640
you need to blind yourself

1220
00:49:32,710 --> 00:49:30,240
and put ear plugs in your ears and not

1221
00:49:35,589 --> 00:49:32,720
think because you're because you're

1222
00:49:37,030 --> 00:49:35,599
somehow cheating if you're using your

1223
00:49:38,790 --> 00:49:37,040
other

1224
00:49:40,950 --> 00:49:38,800
natural

1225
00:49:43,670 --> 00:49:40,960
perceptual abilities you know it's just

1226
00:49:45,829 --> 00:49:43,680
kind of silly so are we really meant to

1227
00:49:47,750 --> 00:49:45,839
be stumbling around in the dark not

1228
00:49:50,150 --> 00:49:47,760
knowing what's going to happen

1229
00:49:52,470 --> 00:49:50,160
either what is happening truly around us

1230
00:49:54,150 --> 00:49:52,480
or what is going to be happening and

1231
00:49:56,069 --> 00:49:54,160
just because a lot of times we don't

1232
00:49:58,069 --> 00:49:56,079
know what's going to be happening

1233
00:50:00,870 --> 00:49:58,079
doesn't mean there should be anything

1234
00:50:03,750 --> 00:50:00,880
wrong if we're taking a peek at it into

1235
00:50:05,750 --> 00:50:03,760
the future and you know maybe i i do

1236
00:50:08,470 --> 00:50:05,760
think that if enough people

1237
00:50:10,950 --> 00:50:08,480
did know how to look into the future if

1238
00:50:12,950 --> 00:50:10,960
and i'm i'm not saying that i even

1239
00:50:14,470 --> 00:50:12,960
think that everything we can see

1240
00:50:17,109 --> 00:50:14,480
everything in the future i think that

1241
00:50:18,790 --> 00:50:17,119
there's some things that are set

1242
00:50:21,510 --> 00:50:18,800
that we can see i think there's

1243
00:50:23,030 --> 00:50:21,520
probabilities that we could tune into

1244
00:50:25,030 --> 00:50:23,040
and then there's a lot of stuff that's

1245
00:50:26,390 --> 00:50:25,040
not it just doesn't exist so we can't

1246
00:50:29,030 --> 00:50:26,400
even see it

1247
00:50:31,349 --> 00:50:29,040
or access it so i think there's all that

1248
00:50:33,670 --> 00:50:31,359
going on but i think that if enough

1249
00:50:35,670 --> 00:50:33,680
people were doing this it actually might

1250
00:50:37,109 --> 00:50:35,680
change our consciousnesses or the way

1251
00:50:39,750 --> 00:50:37,119
that we

1252
00:50:41,990 --> 00:50:39,760
we are as humans and you know you could

1253
00:50:43,990 --> 00:50:42,000
get into well is that a good thing or

1254
00:50:46,150 --> 00:50:44,000
not i don't know if you talk to

1255
00:50:47,349 --> 00:50:46,160
older people from

1256
00:50:50,069 --> 00:50:47,359
you know say

1257
00:50:52,230 --> 00:50:50,079
i mean i'm 53 years old at the moment

1258
00:50:54,950 --> 00:50:52,240
and i know a lot of people that think

1259
00:50:57,829 --> 00:50:54,960
the way life is going with everyone

1260
00:51:00,069 --> 00:50:57,839
being so technologically oriented you

1261
00:51:02,069 --> 00:51:00,079
know they're they're really down on how

1262
00:51:04,950 --> 00:51:02,079
humans are progressing right now with

1263
00:51:06,230 --> 00:51:04,960
the older people but you know are they

1264
00:51:09,589 --> 00:51:06,240
right

1265
00:51:12,870 --> 00:51:09,599
no it's just their opinions so so we

1266
00:51:17,270 --> 00:51:12,880
i think that we are moving along in our

1267
00:51:20,710 --> 00:51:17,280
evolution as humans closer and closer to

1268
00:51:22,950 --> 00:51:20,720
more and more people having full a lot

1269
00:51:25,349 --> 00:51:22,960
fuller access to their ability their

1270
00:51:27,349 --> 00:51:25,359
intuitive abilities than we've ever been

1271
00:51:30,150 --> 00:51:27,359
before and i do think that's going to

1272
00:51:33,109 --> 00:51:30,160
change us and that does open up

1273
00:51:34,309 --> 00:51:33,119
a lot of ethical questions

1274
00:51:35,750 --> 00:51:34,319
but

1275
00:51:37,750 --> 00:51:35,760
i don't know that there's any right and

1276
00:51:39,349 --> 00:51:37,760
wrong there

1277
00:51:41,030 --> 00:51:39,359
now i'll put all the details for the

1278
00:51:42,390 --> 00:51:41,040
book within the description of the show

1279
00:51:44,630 --> 00:51:42,400
as well so if people want to check that

1280
00:51:46,230 --> 00:51:44,640
out it's available via amazon but also

1281
00:51:47,910 --> 00:51:46,240
if you want to support your your local

1282
00:51:50,710 --> 00:51:47,920
bookstores that's always promoted as

1283
00:51:52,309 --> 00:51:50,720
well and encourage folks um i that's

1284
00:51:54,069 --> 00:51:52,319
probably a nice way to segue into the

1285
00:51:55,430 --> 00:51:54,079
listener questions deborah because

1286
00:51:57,030 --> 00:51:55,440
you've brought something up and my

1287
00:51:58,710 --> 00:51:57,040
co-host dan

1288
00:52:00,870 --> 00:51:58,720
i was talking to him about speaking to

1289
00:52:03,030 --> 00:52:00,880
you and any questions he wanted me to

1290
00:52:05,190 --> 00:52:03,040
bring up and you've mentioned you know

1291
00:52:07,510 --> 00:52:05,200
potentially if more people were in touch

1292
00:52:09,349 --> 00:52:07,520
or in tune with these abilities

1293
00:52:12,470 --> 00:52:09,359
how would it change society for the good

1294
00:52:15,109 --> 00:52:12,480
or for the better now elon musk um he

1295
00:52:17,510 --> 00:52:15,119
wants to bring out neuralink which is a

1296
00:52:19,589 --> 00:52:17,520
way for us to it's a chip in your brain

1297
00:52:21,510 --> 00:52:19,599
and it's going to connect us all and you

1298
00:52:23,990 --> 00:52:21,520
know you'll have access to information

1299
00:52:26,950 --> 00:52:24,000
and sharing and do you think

1300
00:52:29,510 --> 00:52:26,960
technology is a kind of bridge between

1301
00:52:32,549 --> 00:52:29,520
us getting to that stage or would that

1302
00:52:34,950 --> 00:52:32,559
potentially be harmful and people

1303
00:52:37,109 --> 00:52:34,960
accessing these types of other abilities

1304
00:52:39,030 --> 00:52:37,119
that is all for this week's show thank

1305
00:52:41,109 --> 00:52:39,040
you very much for listening please

1306
00:52:43,750 --> 00:52:41,119
remember to leave the podcaster review

1307
00:52:46,069 --> 00:52:43,760
on your chosen platform you can like

1308
00:52:47,990 --> 00:52:46,079
retweet and subscribe that would all be

1309
00:52:50,150 --> 00:52:48,000
very much appreciated the shows are

1310
00:52:51,670 --> 00:52:50,160
being uploaded onto youtube as we speak

1311
00:52:54,150 --> 00:52:51,680
more and more you can sign up at

1312
00:52:56,870 --> 00:52:54,160
patreon.com forward slash that ufo

1313
00:52:59,109 --> 00:52:56,880
podcast access shows ad free as well

1314
00:53:01,910 --> 00:52:59,119
please get in touch on twitter facebook

1315
00:53:05,109 --> 00:53:01,920
instagram that ufo podcast of course on

1316
00:53:07,190 --> 00:53:05,119
twitter it's at ufouapam

1317
00:53:10,230 --> 00:53:07,200
and again folks as always keep looking

1318
00:53:31,270 --> 00:53:10,240
up you never know what you might see

1319
00:53:31,280 --> 00:53:36,530
i don't think he expected me

1320
00:53:36,540 --> 00:53:49,349
[Music]

1321
00:53:49,359 --> 00:53:53,270
upstairs

1322
00:53:53,280 --> 00:54:08,790
[Music]

1323
00:54:12,309 --> 00:54:10,549
was weird and everything was red i

1324
00:54:21,140 --> 00:54:12,319
helped my boys they thought this was

1325
00:54:21,150 --> 00:54:35,510
[Music]

1326
00:54:35,520 --> 00:54:40,910
and what's that

1327
00:54:51,270 --> 00:54:45,510
[Music]

1328
00:54:51,280 --> 00:54:55,290
your serious

1329
00:55:18,350 --> 00:55:08,030
[Music]

1330
00:55:38,470 --> 00:55:18,360
it wasn't

1331
00:55:49,970 --> 00:55:40,520
it's very easy

1332
00:55:55,640 --> 00:55:53,270
[Music]

1333
00:56:21,300 --> 00:55:55,650
so